Building Mental Toughness & Longevity

James Blasco (: 00:32

Hello and welcome to another episode of the Charge Forward Coaching Podcast. I'm your host, James Blasco I'm super excited today because not only are we going to talk about mental toughness and the four C's, but we have a genuine expert, Vern Biccum He is the president of Iridia Medical in Vancouver, British Columbia. He is an expert in mental toughness, the four C's. He's a coach. He's also fluent in Chinese, I believe. We'll talk about that. we're going to talk a little bit about

mental toughness and longevity, which is a super important topic. We're gonna cover a lot of bases, but I want to welcome Vern to the show. Thanks for being on.

Vern (: 01:12

James, thank you so much. Really excited to to explore these topics with you. Thank you for the super kind opening. I have to I have to pause on the fluency in Chinese. I have to I can't misrepresent. I'm I'm aspiring to fluency and and one day we'll get there.

James Blasco (: 01:26

Well, you're a lot further than I am at the at the moment. I can guarantee that. So ⁓ we're gonna dive into a lot, totally ex excited, but why don't you give us a brief overview of your background so people know kind of where you're coming from and who you are.

Vern (: 01:40

Sure, I'm happy to. So ⁓ so from an education perspective, I'm I'm a physicist initially, so I have a graduate degree in physics, and then I went on and got my MBA so I could speak the language of business. I thought that was an important piece into the mix. ⁓ and I've gone continued on continuous education in a variety of areas, and as you suggested, now coach as well. I think that where the world is headed, it's really important for us to be able to support people. dynamic and things are changing all the time, so I wanted to have that that ability.

In terms of my day-to-day job, I am, as you mentioned, the president of Iridium Medical. that's an organization that our real focus is being a partner in workplace health. So we work with organizations to look after the health of their workforce, and that looks ⁓ a little different depending on what particular type of offering we're talking about. So we we take clinicians, physicians, nurses, paramedics, we put them into the resource industry, which is really active here in BC. ⁓

We also got started with automatic sterno defibrillators, the things that shock you when you have a sudden cardiac arrest. That's how the company got started. And then we morphed into a lot of organizational health programs, we call them, where we're really, to your point, tying in the ideas of longevity and the pillars of nutrition and sleep and exercise and preventative mental health. And then we also have a front-facing clinic, which does a variety of sort of pre-employment and ongoing assessments of people that we try to feather in the longevity piece.

To really bring that to the fore. So that's kind of me in a nutshell as it relates to education and role.

James Blasco (: 03:15

Yeah, when I was starting to do some research for this interview, I said I'm gonna need more paper to write down my notes because you do so much and ⁓ Iridia does so much. So it's fascinating to me. But we're here today mostly to talk about mental toughness in the four C's, and that's a big connection between you and I. I know we both have that connection to AQR International and MTQ and things like that, but it's a passion for me. I know it's a passion for you. ⁓ why don't we start with

what mental toughness is. I find that most people, they kind of have a general idea and so did I several years ago, but what we know through the the 4C framework is something that they could like get their hands on almost is very tangible. Why don't you help us understand what mental toughness is to you?

Vern (: 04:05

Yeah, no, I I and I one hundred percent agree with you. There's a there's a bit of ⁓ think of it as an image, it it's not quite in focus when you say the word mental toughness. Most people will attach to something, ⁓ and and so what you know, it's it's it most people will say it's a it's a good thing. ⁓ but as we define it, it it's really it's a it's a personality trait. And it's a trait that helps us understand how people respond to challenges and opportunities that come their way, irrespective of their circumstances. And so that's that's

what it is ⁓ and the really neat part about it is it can be worked on it can be elevated it can be enhanced and changed and so that's that's ⁓ that's really the the key part and for us when we when we towed into this and maybe I'll just provide a little bit of segues to how we got into this space ⁓ we were we had physicians ⁓ up in the in the oil patch working with people and there was a need to have counselors and so we were asked can we bring counselors in and so we did ⁓ and we did that for quite some

Some time and we just saw that finally organizations were willing to look at preventative mental health. And so we looked around and we looked around for what was out there and what could be provided that would be helpful. And that's where we bumped into the folks at AQR and what you're referring to as the four C's model, because it it takes mental toughness and it provides a visual for it. Like if you ask most people, hey, is mental toughness a good thing? I think they'll probably say yeah. Would you agree?

James Blasco (: 05:32

Yeah, absolutely.

Vern (: 05:34

Yeah, like there's this fuzzy, yeah, in general it's probably a good thing, but but what is it? And then people don't have any real sense of what it looks like or anything. And so enter this model. And it's it's a great visual that lets us look at it.

And so that was really a a turning point for us as it relates to it. And that's when we speak about the definition of it, for us, it's that trait that can be malleable and it gives us great insight into how somebody deals with what comes at them in life. Because life is dynamic. Nobody's sitting in a static world right now. So it's really, really insightful. ⁓ and then it's it's helpful for them as well. So that's kind of the perspective that we have when we look at it.

James Blasco (: 06:13

Yeah, that it it is amazing. And I know for me, as I was on my journey for several years, I I said there has to be more to this. You know, I don't even know if I was calling it mental toughness at the time, but you know, being able to handle stressors and any in any situation you're in in a constructive, positive way is possible. And I said there has to be a s maybe a, I don't know, a system or something like that. But this is more than a system. This is science-based reality of how to operate under very stressful situations. So why don't

Why don't we dive into the four C's? I'd love to hear your take on each of them.

Vern (: 06:46

Sure.

if we if we put that that image up in front of folks then what we're gonna see is that it's a pizza pie and that that that makes it nice and easy, right? And the reason that we really enjoy it is that it it's it's super accessible. When you look at that pizza pie, you can take what is a very intuitive and more than likely correct assessment of what it is. So the first, and I always like to start in the control segment,

And it has two elements. It has something called life control and it has something called emotional control. And so life control is really the degree to which you feel you have agency over your life.

And when I describe it, I like to think of it as, you know, are are you viewing life as you're a leaf in a stream, you know, kind of floating around and bumping against a rock and maybe a crayfish grabs at you, or maybe you're on the shore, or or do you sort of take more energy and try to shape what's coming at you in your life and what you can do with your life. And that's an important piece of overall control. If you feel as though you can shape your destiny, ⁓ that really allows you to align your actions, and it's super, super powerful.

If we look at emotional control, we all have emotions. Every one of us has emotions. And it's a natural part of life. And the key is how do we recognize them but not let them overtake us and and and potentially take us down a path that that might cause us more grief than it's worth.

James Blasco (: 08:10

And so that emotional control to me, it it stands out huge. When we go through the the rest of the C's, they're all important. I think emotional control. I work with, you know, a lot of athletes and that emotional control is is vital. I know when I was younger and even, you know, throughout my life, there were challenges in that area. And so what what is it about emotional control when the stakes are high that it becomes not not just valuable, but

absolutely critical that you can control and understand your emotions.

Vern (: 08:46

Well I think because the the emotions arise and they could be they could be so intense and they're they're intended to you know they they're they're I mean they're not beings but they're they're well spirited. I mean they're they're coming from a good place, right, generally speaking, and and protective, honestly. And so I think that ⁓ the the rub is if we react and and we've all done it. I I think everybody that's listening to this has been in a situation where an emotion has popped in, they felt compelled to act and then probably instantly regretted it, right? And so that's why it's so important.

So whether it's in sports, whether it's in healthcare, whether it's in business, team dynam dynamic of any f of any ilk, if you react in the moment based on that impetus.

The odds of that serving you well can be very low. So you have to be able to have that recognition of, okay, it's here, I acknowledge it. Don't don't deny the emotion. Don't pretend it's not there, it's here. ⁓ but then what do I do with it? And that's where the mental toughness ⁓ factor of emotional control comes in. To be able to say, hey, it's here, get it, but we're gonna we're gonna carry on. The game's at stake. I can't, I can't lose, lose my perspective over this. And and so those that have developed and worked on

have developed that ability to do so.

James Blasco (: 10:00

And the this is all science backed, research backed. How does that impact and influence like when you're coaching individuals? How does that help you coach them? How does that help them better understand how to do the things you just described?

Vern (: 10:15

Yeah, well I mean again so one of the pieces we we haven't yet touched on is the fact that ⁓

That this model isn't just a standalone model. You referred to it as a system before. So not only is it a model, but it actually comes with a measure along with it. So when we look through the coaching lens, you can have people complete the assessment, and then you have the visual and you know exactly where they sit as it relates to emotional control. So and it's a normative assessment. So it's compared to a very large population, and they'll get a sense of where they sit along the scale. And the first

Is that's really insightful them to understand where they're at. And then even more helpful is that the assessment comes with reports, and those reports come and they can be utilized by the coach to help bring this to bear to explore where does this show up in life and then bring some strategies to bear. So maybe this happens in the field in the moment, maybe it happens in your relationship at home, maybe with your kids, with your partner, and and so the coach can help explore where those where those points are.

are and then there can be interventions brought to bear to help better control those in the moment.

James Blasco (: 11:27

It's so powerful. It's such a amazing tool. I know there's other models out there, things out there that people could lean on, but I believe this has got to be the fastest growing model and resource for individuals helping others grow their mental toughness in all in all of these areas. let's get on to the the next C, and that is commitment. What is what does commitment bring to the table?

Vern (: 11:47

Sure. Hmm.

Yeah, so so commitment is is also I mean every every construct which what the Cs represent as construct are are very important. And this one is about ⁓ the degree to which somebody is is goal oriented and achievement oriented. So those are the two factors that make up the the commitment side. And at first blush you might think, well, are those the same things? And and they're really not. So so goal orientation is the desire to have goals and to set goals. And then we probably all know folks that set goals but maybe

Maybe don't really pursue them very earnestly. And so that's where the achievement orientation comes into the mix. So if if you're able to set goals and do the energy and put the work in to achieve those goals, that's gonna bolster your your your commitment level. And that's incredibly, incredibly important. I mean, I I'm an entrepreneur by nature, and ⁓ one of the things that I I personally believe very strongly is you first make a commitment to

something you tap into your courage you develop capacity and confidence comes out of that

And that's really, really important. So it's starting with that, having that commitment side is so very, very important. ⁓ you know, again, the world is is is is filled with great ideas, but it's the action that actually makes something come forward out of it. So having those goals and then pursuing them is so critically important and and boosts confidence and and everything of that nature and and and just so powerful.

James Blasco (: 13:24

You've accomplished a lot so far in your life. What drives your commitment in the different areas that you've been able to focus on and achieve, you know, pretty high success?

Vern (: 13:35

Yeah, so I mean I think I think well I I appreciate that. I'm I'm just I I'm doing my best to just kind of keep going in life and for me for me it's about living your dash. I don't know if that's an expression you've heard before, but you have your birth year, you have your death year, and in between you have a dash. And so I think that living your dash is is is really, really important and ⁓ you only have one life and soak it up. That's kind of my that's been my approach. And I I think that there's great ⁓ as I mentioned earlier, you you throw your

Into something you flounder a bit, you struggle a bit, you write yourself, you grow, you develop, and I think that's in that's just incredibly rewarding, it's incredibly important, and it spills over into all other areas of life, right? And and so for me, it's been I wanted to do science, so I studied science, and I wanted to diversify science, so it was biophysics, bringing those things together. Then I was like, Well, what's business about? I'm curious about that, and getting that language to overlay. Chinese,

I think it's one of the harder languages out there, so I wanted to sort of learn that. I think it's important and where the world is going and and such. And so my fuel is really is driven by my values, my values of of living a full life. ⁓ and that ⁓ it's up to me to shape my to shape my existence and to shape my experience.

James Blasco (: 14:54

And one day you

woke up and said, Hey, I want to be on a charge forward coaching podcast. I'm I'm gonna put myself out there, right?

Vern (: 15:00

I I had a vision. I had a vision and

this gentleman named James popped into it and and and and here we are and here we are. Yeah. Yeah on the big show.

James Blasco (: 15:07

Here we are, right? On the big show. So ⁓ you

kind of segued fairly nicely into the next C, which is challenge. It's one of my favorite to talk about what is what is challenge in the four C's.

Vern (: 15:20

Right.

so as it relates to as it relates to challenge, you've got your two components, your risk orientation and you've got your ⁓ learning orientation. And the the first is is really speaking to your your

Comfort with change, right? And we live in a in an incredibly dynamic world right now through all measures, politics, financial, technology, AI, learning. And so change is a reality that is coming. And so your comfort with ⁓ risk and and and in the form of change is important for you to be aware of. And then the learning orientation speaks more to your interest in learning, your appetite for learning. And it can be both forward, as I say, that's when you choose to learn something about.

a topic of interest to you, but also mining the historic experiences you've had for the learning that they afford you. Okay? So that's a really, really important piece I think in in life, as life is dynamic and as it is changing, is you've gone through these these these experiences and and pulling the pieces you like and and maybe learning from those that you didn't enjoy so that again you can you can shape what what comes forward with you. And one of the points that's really important to

identify and talk about James is that with all of these factors, they're measured on a scale. And there's no there's no real right. There's no real wrong. It's not about having a a maximum value for each of the factors. It's more about understanding where you sit along the scale and then understanding what's best for your best self. And for different people it will be different. But having that awareness, which is a big part of what going through and and looking at the success of it provides you is the ability then to on your own and

And with the support of a coach, ⁓ develop and change your particular factor. So somebody might be very, very ⁓ risk-oriented, maybe irresponsibly risk-oriented. And and we can be careful because sometimes our roles in our in our ⁓ in our profession influence us, and we have to see how that ports to our life. So you can imagine, for example, somebody that's in a an emergency response environment. There are inherent risks in the role.

And they have to sometimes go into those risk environments. They mitigate the best they can. But that that sort of approach of of of taking on those risks may not be something they need to do in their own personal financial planning, for example. And so having that insight as to where you sit and then being able to just see how it plays in other parts of your life is really, really insightful.

James Blasco (: 17:54

I know you talk and work a lot with individuals on longevity and that's such a a big topic, especially nowadays. What what what do you see the connection with specifically challenge and longevity?

Vern (: 18:09

Yeah. Well, I mean, first of all, longevity ties beautifully to every factor in this and and that's the elegance of it. Because if you're gonna be around and doing anything for an extended period of time, be it sport, be it business, be it anything, you're gonna you're gonna see change. It's inevitable. No matter what it is your existence is, you're going to see change. So you have to have some level of of of way to manage that change so that you can be around for that long duration, irrespective of what it is. And so

So as it relates to health, which is really our primary lens of longevity, ⁓ you're gonna have to try new things. I don't know, James, what's what's your favorite, what's your least favorite workout exercise? Okay. Now I'm I'm not gonna say that you have to do burpees to live a long life.

James Blasco (: 18:50

My li ⁓ burpees. Burpees, yeah. So I hate burpees. Hate

Vern (: 18:59

But I might tell you that there could be an opportunity or a time when it makes the most sense for that to be the exercise of choice. So you're gonna have to be I'll give you my example. I I don't like squats. But I got up this morning at seven AM and I did my

10 sets of 10. I'm in a build phase. So I did a hundred squats today. I don't like it. It's not not but I know it's part of the it's part of the journey. It's part of there's a vision in mind, there's a goal in mine, and so I'll I'll double down and I'll do it. And I think that's the risk orientation piece is you gotta do things you don't love. They're gonna make you a little uncomfortable, but they're part of a broader plan. And then the learning, you've gotta learn, you gotta learn technique. You've got to learn what it does for you. You gotta learn that it's important to do things you don't like.

You gotta learn that, you know what, any phase of anything is not permanent. It's evolving, it's always changing. And so I think that's how challenge fits into the mix as it relates to longevity for me. Both willing to try new things, because for longevity you gotta eat different things, you gotta sleep a different way, you gotta exercise in multi-dimensions, and you gotta look at your your mental health in a way that you probably haven't. And then you gotta learn as you're going through all of this. but in a fun way, hopefully.

James Blasco (: 20:13

Yeah, it it is fascinating. Yeah, I've seen a lot of people, both sports and in sales, that if if they don't have the challenge aspect of mental toughness figured out or at least growing, they they really struggle because you you get so much rejection and failures and defeat. And the only way to improve is to get better and keep doing it. But they stop. And it's unfortunate because they're probably most of them are pretty talented. ⁓

Vern (: 20:37

Yeah.

James Blasco (: 20:43

But they just don't understand that yet. And that's where good coaching could come in, right? And they could get a better grip on that.

Vern (: 20:48

Well.

Absolutely, and one of the key things I'll just I'll just tie in here because it fits so elegantly. You set the stage so beautifully. I've been invited to dinner. I have to I have to bring this forward. And and and that is that reflection is so fundamentally important, right? That's a part of learning. And that's something that I think that that people struggle with a little bit. And so those folks that you say that that if they don't have it figured out and they they give up, the sad reality is they may have been making amazing progress. And ⁓ I'll borrow something from Strategic Coach, it's a group I belong to.

James Blasco (: 20:57

Ha ha.

Vern (: 21:20

to and they have many very elegant explanations for things. But one's called Mind the Gap. And so I want to imagine that ⁓ that you're if we if we can take the the the the the audience to you know the west coast of North America just for illustrative purposes and you're they're on a boat, they're on a cruise ship and they're leaving Vancouver and or Seattle and they're they're heading to they're heading to Australia.

As they look out that front off the bow of the boat every day, that view is pretty much the same. Doesn't look like they're making any progress at all. But if they turn and they look and they see how far they've come from Vancouver, that's where you see the real magic.

And so being able to reflect, and so maybe you failed, and maybe you lost a set in tennis, or maybe you didn't win this, but look at at the progression that you've made, the incremental improvements that you've made. You know, Rome wasn't built in a night style of thinking. And that's the value of that reflective element of the challenge piece. That that is so, so very important.

James Blasco (: 22:22

Yeah, I I personally do that and maybe you do too. A lot of people, you know, I've learned, you know, I journal and I'll I'll look back. I did this morning on this date last year and kind of wanted to see where I was at and see you know, and it's funny because I remember that particular day after I I was reading it and how I was gonna interview somebody well versed in mental toughness as as as you are. And I could remember feeling like, wow, I'm I'm nervous and

How did I handle that? And here I am now with you, kind of doing the same thing, but I feel a lot different. It's easier with you, ⁓ your personality and so forth. But it's just something that you should be doing. You should be going back and, you know, reviewing your goals, your journal, you know, all those things to get a better idea and perspective of where you are now. Cause nine times out of ten, you're a hell of a lot further down the road than you ever thought you were. Yeah.

Vern (: 23:14

hundred

percent and and one of the things that we do at at our org is is that we you know we look at life and and life life is nothing more than a collection of days right and collection of weeks same same metaphor and so we have again it's borrowed from my coach program but it is a it is a weekly planner and and that weekly planner starts off with before you talk about what you're gonna do for the week you have to start with the positives from the week that was

And that's by design. You start with that. And it's not just okay, I did this. It's why was that an achievement? And then the next phase is what do you do to keep the momentum or what's next? Because if you've done something and it you're proud of it and it's an achievement, you could probably do it in another part of your work or another part of your life, or you could schedule to do it again if it was a happenstance thing that popped up and you solved it the moment. What are you pulling from that? So the combination of reflecting and

And then later, now you've got an entire quarter which becomes four quarters, which becomes a year. To your point, James, you can flip it out and say, Holy, I remember a year ago I was nervous about this podcast and now I'm killing it with this guy from Vancouver. Like it's just it's the the benefit out of it is just so huge. ⁓ and it's and it's a simple tool. It's a simple thing to do. ⁓ and but the upside is so great.

James Blasco (: 24:27

Yeah.

Yeah, it it truly is. All right. Well, now on to the fourth C. Some say it's the most important C. I don't know if you could say that they're all important, but it's confidence. What what is confidence outside of what people think it is?

Vern (: 24:52

Yeah, so again, in in this model, confidence comes in two flavors. It comes in a in a confidence of in of abilities, inabilities, and then the confidence, ⁓ interpersonal confidence. And this one's really fascinating when you start to look at teams, I would say. So I I've seen a lot of examples, which is tragic, of of people that are confident in abilities

but their interpersonal confidence is low. And how that plays out is if you don't know that as somebody who's leading a team or managing a group, that voice is probably not gonna show up.

You're not going to get that input from them. And so that awareness that that's the case, you can find different venues by which to get that input. And of course, if the person is made aware of that, then they can work on developing that confidence. But it's really important. Life, life is not a solitary journey. And that's certainly the case with longevity. And we're gonna have to put your hand up and say, hey, I don't know how to do this. You're gonna need to get some help. So maybe, James, when you're going to do burpees because you hate them so much, like, I don't know how to do what's the proper form of a burpee. You're gonna have to ask

somebody and it might be silly because everybody knows a burpee right that could be a response but but it it's the no I want the proper technique teach me how to do it and so putting that hand up and whether it's in personal life and the in a fashion like I just talked about or or work life or or even relationships and having imagine not not if you don't have that confidence to to state what's on your mind and what you need. Imagine the strength of relationships if you were able to articulate what you do need and what you want. That would be super super powerful.

And of course confidence and abilities. ⁓ A lot of that to me how you can some of the ways you can build that is again that positive reflecting on things and realizing that your abilities are developing even if they're not at that end state where you want them to be in the moment.

James Blasco (: 26:43

Yeah, it's it's kind of funny sometimes when I'm talking to athletes, especially young athletes, and they wanna confidence is a big topic. I think emotional control, confidence, those two things are probably are the biggest conversations and where people stand on their assessments and things. And they'll talk about, well, how do I how do I get that confidence? I'm like, in your abilities? Yeah. ⁓ practice. Keep you know, practice and practice. And like you said, reflect and learn and practice. And there's no escaping that.

you could you could have mental toughness in all the different areas, but to be confident you you do have to develop your skill set and you deal h do have to grow that over time. There's no getting around that, even if you're, you know, so called, you know, born with that ability.

Vern (: 27:28

And it's true, and and I think that one of the things that helps when people don't appreciate necessarily their abilities is is is breaking it down. Because keep in mind they've got that ultimate vision, being the best player, being the best at X or Y or Z, and breaking it down for them and helping them understand that, okay, like let's take a jump shot. Maybe your jump shot and basketball's not going in, but your mechanics are strong and and and the the the right pieces are there. It's just a matter of time and then things will click. I I'm sure in sport you've seen that many, many times.

times where all of a sudden things come together, right? And it it takes time. And and if you lose the person before the the connectivity happens, so tragic, because it was right there, just beneath the surface.

James Blasco (: 28:12

Yep. I yeah and I have seen it, unfortunately. But I've I've seen the other side too, where somebody increases their dedication focus and so forth. And it really changes everything. So we I know we covered a lot. We we will definitely regroup and do more, but I have a few more questions. What what what impact has the four Cs model framework had on you as a person and also Iridia Medical and your coaching?

Vern (: 28:28

Hit me, yeah.

Yeah, so for for me as a person I think the biggest insight is so I I I got my results. And one of the one of the problems that I have is ⁓ I kinda tend to view myself well, I'm I'm a person. I'm just a person, just like everyone else. And so

Everyone must be like me. And I think that's not an uncommon thing initially, right? Before you've done the sort of the the the the self-reflection as it relates to this model. And so for me the big thing is was around goal orientation and achievement orientation. So you mentioned some of the things that I enjoy pursuing. Tough languages, advanced degrees, that's not everybody's jam, right? And so where that comes to be really important in a in a team-based environment is if I don't have the understanding

and that others aren't like that, I'm going to burn them out. And that's a very, very real risk. And so I have to try, and it's it's it's an ongoing commitment on my part, to try to try to r reduce that that expectation and that and and have the understanding that people are at different levels as it relates to every factor and and in particular achievement and goal orientation. I happen to believe that we can achieve anything.

So so having that awareness in my case of the fact that I'm super goal oriented and that having a list of an extensive list of small, medium, and big goals doesn't cause me any angst. But understanding that that may not be the case for the team allows me then to break up their goals into into smaller bite-sized pieces that are more likely to keep them engaged in the process. So I don't I don't lose them, they don't become sort of overwhelmed. And and that actually, James, is really important piece for all

of the factors. I mentioned it earlier, but it's about being the best version of self. And so when people are very much over to the the the the mentally tough end of the spectrum, there can be some blind spots that appear. And emotional control is an example. And I think that's really worth touching on. I know it's not part of the exactly the question, but I I think it's valuable if if I can take a take a leeway here. Okay.

James Blasco (: 30:47

Absolutely.

Vern (: 30:48

So in in emergency response environments, that emotional control imperative. You wanna have it and and you want your leadership to be on point and and stoic and and holding it all together. Amazingly important. Once that stimulus and that stress environment's gone, y y you also gotta be cautious if you're there and you're very, very mentally tough in the area of emotional control, that people might not be able to read you.

in other environments. And so if you're having a team that's a multi-generational team, you've got maybe some younger folks coming in that are are more accustomed maybe than someone of our generation or older generation talking about how they feel, y you wanna be in in the words of one of our psychologist partners, a little bit messy to be relatable.

And that's a really powerful piece. So for me, that was a learning as well of emotional control to try to try to understand how my emotions and how I'm reacting plays for others and similarly on the goal side of things as well. Now that's my answer. And then as an organization, what we've ⁓ recently just stepped into is everybody ⁓ we used to use the MTQ Plus upon recruitment, but now we actually use it ⁓ also for everybody that wants to. They've been a partner with a coach.

and they can actually go through and and develop their mental toughness as they see fit or any other coaching pursuit that they want, but that's just one way that we're bringing it to bear. I truly believe that the more we know about ourselves individually, the better we're able to show up in any other environment.

James Blasco (: 32:21

Absolutely. I applaud you for that. I think that's outstanding that you can, you know, give that to your organization. That's an incredible gift and opportunity and you know benefits them. It benefits the organization. So hats off to you for that. It's funny you bring up, you know, healthcare and medical field My wife's a cardiac ICU nurse. We both took the assessment. She she's she was higher than me at the time, but no shock there. But you're right that you know, she deals with a lot of

Vern (: 32:42

well.

James Blasco (: 32:50

⁓ pressures and stressors and you know emotionally she keeps it together. And I think she's one of those individuals that the the balance between what's happening there in that work environment and those serious environments and then being around family, friends, and other situations. I think she's one of the most self-aware humans I've I've been around. And it makes a huge difference because you can't just stay stuck in that silo of

You know, where you are on the mental toughness scale with any of the factors.

Vern (: 33:22

amazing that that that she is and and and I I you know, I wish that we we were all more so. We're all more that that way. I I think the world would be a ⁓ like I say, a a much better place if we all understood where we stood on that and were able to do that that switch. So that's fantastic.

James Blasco (: 33:38

So just a couple more questions. What do you think is the most common ⁓ of the factors that people work on when you you get assessments and you you talk to them? What stands out as the factor that usually is at the top of the list where someone wants to improve?

Vern (: 33:55

Yeah, I think I think in my in in in my experience there's a couple that jump out for me. So one one is around goal setting. And I think that ⁓ it call it actually w we'll call it ⁓ we'll call it commitment overall, because both the goal setting and the achievement orientation I think. So

You know, I think that when we're younger and we're we're in school and and life is a little bit more curated for us, we do this, we do this, we do this. When we then graduate, I think that that's where you see a lot of different things manifest. And I think it's possible to graduate, have a role, and kind of get into autopilot. And then you kind of advance and then some years settle in, you're like, I'm not really sure I'm happy, I don't know where I'm at and the goal setting piece, because

Nobody's mandating that you do that. It's not homework. It's not a job expectation. There's not a performance review. Work-related goals are a bit different. I s in in general terms, setting goals and pursuing them, I think is an area that a lot of folks ⁓ struggle with. And and and also the ability to to craft them in a way we don't have to use all elements of the SMART model, but certainly timelines and measurability in your goals being really, really important. And I think that's that's certainly one area.

that I would say jumps out at me. And then the other one, ⁓ we touched on earlier, is the reflective learning. I don't know, James, do you see folks in your in your in your life that make the same sort of ⁓ mistakes repeatedly and

James Blasco (: 35:26

Unfortunately, yes,

happens a lot.

Vern (: 35:30

Yeah. And and so if we can if we can just support folks to to acknowledge, okay, mistake made. Awesome. ⁓ but not just don't be embarrassed about it. Don't hide under the sheets. Just just okay, ⁓ it happened. I did it. Great. And and what can you pull from that? Why? Why did that happen? And also do the same with success.

Because some people just, yay, success, yeah. And then they write on to the next thing. But but hold on, how did how did you get that success? Like what led to that? There's things there that you can you can pull forward and then make things better over here. And and I think those two areas are two of the key, key areas for me that I see as a goal setting. ⁓ and the ability to ⁓ the learning orientation, especially the reflective element.

James Blasco (: 36:15

All right, so here's a simple question, kind of kidding. what what's your message to somebody who wants to better understand not just mental toughness, but how to build that mental toughness and resilience in their life? And maybe they're hearing some of this information for the first time and it's making sense to them, but what would your message be to them about here's the next step you take?

Vern (: 36:39

the first thing I think of is I'm gonna I'm gonna borrow a a quote and then get to a real tactical next step. Is that is that a fair approach to this to this answer? So so I mean I think the first thing is it ha have a vision for what what what do you want? Like what are you interested in and start small and act now.

James Blasco (: 36:46

Absolutely. Yep.

Absolutely.

Vern (: 36:58

That's kind of the piece. That's a Robin Sharma quote. He's kind of our ⁓ what how would I describe him? He is a he is a more subdued Tony Robbins. Canadian c Canadian ⁓

James Blasco (: 37:08

Ha ha.

Vern (: 37:09

Canadian ⁓ gentlemen in the same sort of industry. That's that's the overarching message is you're curious about it, amazing. Think about it, start small and act now. And then that act now piece, what I would say, is look into look into an assessment like this. This is incredibly it's it's a it's a low cost, it's an easy, it's a barrier-free thing. You can have it done and and then explore what it looks like. And just see what see what comes out of it. Everybody that we've ever sat with and walked through a debrief.

Everybody has said there's been a couple people that says, well I'd I'd I'm surprised at this little piece I thought maybe a little bit but overall on on balance most people like yep this certainly tracks and there's a sort of an awareness a light bulb that goes off in folks and ⁓ that's very very powerful and that's a very easy step to be done right away is to do that.

James Blasco (: 38:04

Yeah, it certainly is. I know when I had gone through it, the light bulb does go off. And you're like, wow, thank, thank God that this is here because it really is a a roadmap to improve in those areas you you either need or or want to improve in. Vern, this has been awesome. I'm gonna have you back. No doubt about it. How can people either learn more about you, Iridia Medical your coaching, how do they get in touch with you, all that good stuff.

Vern (: 38:30

Yeah, no, and I I I pr appreciate the opportunity. I do have a question for you before we before we wrap this up, but I will I will share that information. So ⁓ it it is my first name Vern, my last name Biccum So that's on LinkedIn, that's how you would find me. And then for the purposes of email, it would be my first initial, V, my last name, B-I-C-C-U-M at Iridia Medical. I-R-I-D-I-A-medical dot com. My question for you.

James Blasco (: 38:56

Awesome.

Vern (: 38:58

What was the ⁓ 'cause you've done an amazing job of asking me all the questions and I'd like to hear from you about about what what insights did you receive in your profile as you went through? You spoke a little bit about your wife, but what about yourself? What popped up for you, James?

James Blasco (: 39:09

Yeah.

So th what what was the on the the the lower side of the score? I I came out as a four overall. Four overall. And ⁓ I was a three. My lowest was emotional control. And maybe that's why I'm fascinated and always have been in that that specific area. And what really stood out was most of the other factors. I was like four or five, I think I had one six in there, but

Vern (: 39:17

Okay. Okay. Yeah?

Okay.

James Blasco (: 39:39

it was, you know, I was right in that middle average, except for emotional control. And like you said, when I saw it, and then I shared it with my wife too. We we shared our results. I I was I wasn't surprised because I knew that was an area that I I could probably use some work on. ⁓ not that that sensitivity is always a a a bad thing, but I knew for me in certain situations it it certainly didn't it didn't help me. So

It it is, and I tell people even when I'm coaching with them, I'm up it's I share that information. It's okay because that's part of the journey, part of the path, ⁓ the important role that knowing right in front of you ⁓ is your roadmap to improve in the areas you want to improve. And you have to be honest about it. You have to become aware of this in yourself and be honest with yourself. But from that.

You're you're going to be able to do some amazing things and improve areas of your life and reach some goals that maybe you never thought you got to. Just even if you just improved a little, go from a three to a five or four to a six, something like that. It makes a world of difference. And knowing what it is and how to potentially change it, I think that's life altering right there. Yep.

Vern (: 40:56

great and you're you're

absolutely right it it it truly is and and the the the you made a really ⁓ a salient point which I think it goes back to is you know there there's no right or wrong on on the scale as to where it is. It's it's all about for you and your and your life what what is the the the way to get you to best self. That's really what's important. The goal isn't to be way over on a ten across the board. That that yields shadow behavior that we have to then be aware of. So it's for you and your context what matters most and so I think that's

that's a really, really important point and and you're right, the honesty of hey, this is looking at it and this is this is yourself kind of unveiled, if you will, and and and facing up to it. So yeah, it's fun.

James Blasco (: 41:38

Yeah, it it is awesome. I I look forward to having more conversations with you. Anything I could do to help you, your organization, I'm happy to do that. Maybe one day I could come out to Vancouver and we could, you know, work there. I'd love to see that part of the world. I know it's beautiful, but happy to do that and thank you so much for being on. I know our listeners have learned a lot today.

Vern (: 42:00

thank you. ⁓ honestly an absolute honor to be here today. ⁓ it is an open invitation to visit the Iridiaplex anytime you are here. I would be I would be upset if you came and did not tell me that you were coming. So I would love to host. I would love to to to to do some work with you and to show you this this great place. And yeah I I hope there's been a value and any questions that anybody has from your audience I'm happy to field it.

And last thing I'll say to them as they're as they're jumping into this thing is is really be curious, have fun and and be gentle with self. It's it's it's a journey.

James Blasco (: 42:35

That's for sure. Be gentle with self. It's a it's a learning process for sure. Well, thanks again for the rest of you out there. Don't forget to like and share and subscribe and all that good stuff. You can always go to chargeforwardcoaching.com, learn a little bit more about mental toughness, learn a little bit about more about me and my coaching, and maybe even schedule a just free discovery call so I can learn a little bit more about you and your goals and where you're at with mental toughness. But in the meantime, just keep charging forward.